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	<title>Comments on: and lo, at the Outback they rejoiced</title>
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	<description>thoughtful personal finance, career and health advice</description>
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		<title>By: The Financial Blogger &#124; Financial ramblings</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-8833</link>
		<dc:creator>The Financial Blogger &#124; Financial ramblings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Jan 2008 11:00:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-8833</guid>
		<description>[...] Prodigal Son Finance by Brip [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Prodigal Son Finance by Brip [...]</p>
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		<title>By: An Interview and the Carnivals &#124; beingfrugal.net</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-8599</link>
		<dc:creator>An Interview and the Carnivals &#124; beingfrugal.net</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 20:51:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-8599</guid>
		<description>[...] a hint.&#160; I submitted my post about my tax kicker refund.&#160; Also be sure to read about the naughty boy at Brip Blap.&#160; I&#8217;m sure you&#8217;ll recognize the story that post was taken from before [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a hint.&nbsp; I submitted my post about my tax kicker refund.&nbsp; Also be sure to read about the naughty boy at <a href="http://www.bripblap.com" >Brip Blap</a>.&nbsp; I&#8217;m sure you&#8217;ll recognize the story that post was taken from before [...]
<p style="opacity:0.5;padding:0;margin:0;display:inline;"><sub><a href="http://www.janhvizdak.com/make-donation-cross-linker-plugin-wordpress.php" onclick="window.open('http://www.janhvizdak.com/make-donation-cross-linker-plugin-wordpress.php'); return false;" target="_blank" style="cursor:help;"><b>&#187;crosslinked&#171;</b></a></sub></p>
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		<title>By: carnival of money stories: bedtime story edition : plonkee money</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-8418</link>
		<dc:creator>carnival of money stories: bedtime story edition : plonkee money</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 12:02:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-8418</guid>
		<description>[...] upon a time, there was a very little naughty boy, and his name was George. George didn&#8217;t like to do important things, and he didn&#8217;t [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] upon a time, there was a very little naughty boy, and his name was George. George didn&#8217;t like to do important things, and he didn&#8217;t [...]</p>
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		<title>By: JHS</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7636</link>
		<dc:creator>JHS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jan 2008 19:33:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7636</guid>
		<description>Thanks for participating in this week&#039;s Carnival of Family Life, hosted by Karen at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.take2max.com/blog/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Write from Karen&lt;/a&gt;!  Your post is a great contribution.  Be sure to stop by tomorrow and check out all the other wonderful submissions for this week -- we have a wonderful selection of articles from some very talented writers.  

Considered hosting the Carnival?  You can review the schedule at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.jhsiess.com/carnival-family-life/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Colloquium&lt;/a&gt; and then drop me a note indicating the week you are interesting in hosting!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for participating in this week&#8217;s Carnival of Family Life, hosted by Karen at <a href="http://www.take2max.com/blog/" rel="nofollow">Write from Karen</a>!  Your post is a great contribution.  Be sure to stop by tomorrow and check out all the other wonderful submissions for this week &#8212; we have a wonderful selection of articles from some very talented writers.  </p>
<p>Considered hosting the Carnival?  You can review the schedule at <a href="http://www.jhsiess.com/carnival-family-life/" rel="nofollow">Colloquium</a> and then drop me a note indicating the week you are interesting in hosting!</p>
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		<title>By: Steve (Brip Blap)</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7532</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve (Brip Blap)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jan 2008 17:33:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7532</guid>
		<description>@Randall:  True, I haven&#039;t ever really isolated that one point - why doesn&#039;t the father go round up the elder son and bring him to the celebration?  Why does he have to find out about it secondhand?  I suppose if the father told the elder son to take the day off and come with him to celebrate his brother&#039;s return, it would have seemed less harsh.  Good point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Randall:  True, I haven&#8217;t ever really isolated that one point &#8211; why doesn&#8217;t the father go round up the elder son and bring him to the celebration?  Why does he have to find out about it secondhand?  I suppose if the father told the elder son to take the day off and come with him to celebrate his brother&#8217;s return, it would have seemed less harsh.  Good point.</p>
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		<title>By: Randall</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7521</link>
		<dc:creator>Randall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jan 2008 14:30:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7521</guid>
		<description>I could never quite fathom this parable either. 
True, the lost son comes back, but the father could have INCLUDED the responsible son in the celebration from the beginning, letting him know why he was celebrating, rather than &#039;assuming&#039; that he would feel the same way. 

The father was happy his lost son came back, the brother only saw that his irresponsible brother was back in town. 

I think the father did appear to be playing favorites as well. If I were the dutiful son, I might be more inclined to act more like the lost son to get some attention.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I could never quite fathom this parable either.<br />
True, the lost son comes back, but the father could have INCLUDED the responsible son in the celebration from the beginning, letting him know why he was celebrating, rather than &#8216;assuming&#8217; that he would feel the same way. </p>
<p>The father was happy his lost son came back, the brother only saw that his irresponsible brother was back in town. </p>
<p>I think the father did appear to be playing favorites as well. If I were the dutiful son, I might be more inclined to act more like the lost son to get some attention.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve (Brip Blap)</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7340</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve (Brip Blap)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 11:31:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7340</guid>
		<description>@Steward:  Very good point - in a sense, the father&#039;s celebration for his younger son might be sending the wrong message to the younger son.  Complete rejection would be sending the wrong message, too, though.  Finding the balance would of course be one of those terribly difficult things that spring up from time to time during our lives...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Steward:  Very good point &#8211; in a sense, the father&#8217;s celebration for his younger son might be sending the wrong message to the younger son.  Complete rejection would be sending the wrong message, too, though.  Finding the balance would of course be one of those terribly difficult things that spring up from time to time during our lives&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Steward</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7321</link>
		<dc:creator>Steward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 06:52:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7321</guid>
		<description>I think I agree with Ruth and Steve in that  in continuing the parable we would find the younger son working for an honest wage, just like anybody else would.  But I think that I may disagree slightly in that I would see it as an expression of complete forgiveness and as the most loving thing that the Father could have done for his son.  What would it have profited the prodigal if the Father does not use the circumstances to cure his boy of his waywardness?  It would be a terribly unloving Father who would overlook his child&#039;s fatal errors - so I think that both love and complete forgiveness are very consistent with the idea that the prodigal will have to work and work hard once he is restored to his father.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I agree with Ruth and Steve in that  in continuing the parable we would find the younger son working for an honest wage, just like anybody else would.  But I think that I may disagree slightly in that I would see it as an expression of complete forgiveness and as the most loving thing that the Father could have done for his son.  What would it have profited the prodigal if the Father does not use the circumstances to cure his boy of his waywardness?  It would be a terribly unloving Father who would overlook his child&#8217;s fatal errors &#8211; so I think that both love and complete forgiveness are very consistent with the idea that the prodigal will have to work and work hard once he is restored to his father.</p>
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		<title>By: Emily</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7312</link>
		<dc:creator>Emily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 03:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7312</guid>
		<description>&quot;Human history would be much simpler if everyone offered complete and unconditional forgiveness for all errors, wouldn’t it? &quot;

It sure would!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Human history would be much simpler if everyone offered complete and unconditional forgiveness for all errors, wouldn’t it? &#8221;</p>
<p>It sure would!</p>
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		<title>By: Steve (Brip Blap)</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7310</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve (Brip Blap)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 03:18:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7310</guid>
		<description>Actually, plonkee, I think the opposite - &quot;nonrighteous&quot; indignation is the myth.  Everyone tends to feel righteous when they feel indignified.  Boy, if that wasn&#039;t a string of made-up words...

I don&#039;t think the parable is attempting to show &quot;familial&quot; love per se.  It&#039;s attempting to show religious love - i.e. God&#039;s love for all, regardless of past history of sin, forgiveness is granted equally and fully.  That&#039;s a religious interpretation that is not really up for debate.  The bigger question is if you apply a secular lens to the question.  I say a parent has an obligation to the elder son TO show favoritism.  Otherwise people go insane, the system breaks down and things get hairy.  I think the elder son is right to be angry, in the secular interpretation.  I think the parable has to continue - as Ruth said - with the father slamming the younger son into the mail room to work for peanuts paying room and board for his bedroom.  I really couldn&#039;t imagine complete forgiveness in this case (again, from a secular point of view). 

It&#039;s really a fascinating story the more you think about it.  Human history would be much simpler if everyone offered complete and unconditional forgiveness for all errors, wouldn&#039;t it?  If you need an example, look at the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa.  A horrible bloody civil war never happened there.   It&#039;s a simple, clear concept that it seldom put into action - and that&#039;s a pity.  I am not sure if it&#039;s lack of capability for forgiveness or simply too much horror to be forgiven sometimes...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, plonkee, I think the opposite &#8211; &#8220;nonrighteous&#8221; indignation is the myth.  Everyone tends to feel righteous when they feel indignified.  Boy, if that wasn&#8217;t a string of made-up words&#8230;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think the parable is attempting to show &#8220;familial&#8221; love per se.  It&#8217;s attempting to show religious love &#8211; i.e. God&#8217;s love for all, regardless of past history of sin, forgiveness is granted equally and fully.  That&#8217;s a religious interpretation that is not really up for debate.  The bigger question is if you apply a secular lens to the question.  I say a parent has an obligation to the elder son TO show favoritism.  Otherwise people go insane, the system breaks down and things get hairy.  I think the elder son is right to be angry, in the secular interpretation.  I think the parable has to continue &#8211; as Ruth said &#8211; with the father slamming the younger son into the mail room to work for peanuts paying room and board for his bedroom.  I really couldn&#8217;t imagine complete forgiveness in this case (again, from a secular point of view). </p>
<p>It&#8217;s really a fascinating story the more you think about it.  Human history would be much simpler if everyone offered complete and unconditional forgiveness for all errors, wouldn&#8217;t it?  If you need an example, look at the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa.  A horrible bloody civil war never happened there.   It&#8217;s a simple, clear concept that it seldom put into action &#8211; and that&#8217;s a pity.  I am not sure if it&#8217;s lack of capability for forgiveness or simply too much horror to be forgiven sometimes&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: plonkee</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7291</link>
		<dc:creator>plonkee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 21:31:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7291</guid>
		<description>&quot;even when we sit in unrighteous indignation at the actions of others.&quot;

Sometimes I think that righteous indignation is a myth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;even when we sit in unrighteous indignation at the actions of others.&#8221;</p>
<p>Sometimes I think that righteous indignation is a myth.</p>
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		<title>By: Steward</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7265</link>
		<dc:creator>Steward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 19:20:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7265</guid>
		<description>I think that whether or not the other brother forgives the prodigal (or even if he &#039;forgives&#039; the Father for that matter)  is something that is meant to be left open in this story because I think the answer is supposed to be evident to the hearer.  The other brother _should_ forgive the prodigal and he ought to learn from his Father.  The reason I think that this is the case is because of what the original story seems to say - in getting his inheritance early the prodigal was acting like the Father was dead already.  It was like saying, &quot;Hey there pops, your as good as dead to me so please give me my good stuff now.&quot;  How offensive!

This makes how the Father responds all that more beautiful, and that is the main lesson - I think - of this story.  It teaches us that love conquers even the stupidest of mistakes.  Love rejoices in people more than it does in things.  And Love&#039;s affection never flags in zeal, despite whatever stupid, wasteful thing we do or even when we sit in unrighteous indignation at the actions of others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that whether or not the other brother forgives the prodigal (or even if he &#8216;forgives&#8217; the Father for that matter)  is something that is meant to be left open in this story because I think the answer is supposed to be evident to the hearer.  The other brother _should_ forgive the prodigal and he ought to learn from his Father.  The reason I think that this is the case is because of what the original story seems to say &#8211; in getting his inheritance early the prodigal was acting like the Father was dead already.  It was like saying, &#8220;Hey there pops, your as good as dead to me so please give me my good stuff now.&#8221;  How offensive!</p>
<p>This makes how the Father responds all that more beautiful, and that is the main lesson &#8211; I think &#8211; of this story.  It teaches us that love conquers even the stupidest of mistakes.  Love rejoices in people more than it does in things.  And Love&#8217;s affection never flags in zeal, despite whatever stupid, wasteful thing we do or even when we sit in unrighteous indignation at the actions of others.</p>
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		<title>By: Early Retirement Extreme</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7262</link>
		<dc:creator>Early Retirement Extreme</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 17:48:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7262</guid>
		<description>For me the pertinent question is whether people should be rewarded relative to expectations or relative to an absolute measure. I think I am firmly in the latter camp.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For me the pertinent question is whether people should be rewarded relative to expectations or relative to an absolute measure. I think I am firmly in the latter camp.</p>
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		<title>By: plonkee</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7246</link>
		<dc:creator>plonkee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 13:46:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7246</guid>
		<description>In the story, it&#039;s not made clear what happens to the younger son after the celebration. He certainly gets more than he thinks he is worth, but whether that continues beyond the one day or not, is not exactly stated. 

I&#039;m aware of how it is traditionally interpreted, but it&#039;s a story, you should interpret and apply it as you read it. And I actually think that it&#039;s right to celebrate people (including me) overcoming their own mistakes, but that doesn&#039;t necessarily mean that you then give them the family farm, or whatever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the story, it&#8217;s not made clear what happens to the younger son after the celebration. He certainly gets more than he thinks he is worth, but whether that continues beyond the one day or not, is not exactly stated. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m aware of how it is traditionally interpreted, but it&#8217;s a story, you should interpret and apply it as you read it. And I actually think that it&#8217;s right to celebrate people (including me) overcoming their own mistakes, but that doesn&#8217;t necessarily mean that you then give them the family farm, or whatever.</p>
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		<title>By: Ruth</title>
		<link>http://www.bripblap.com/prodigal-son-finance/comment-page-1/#comment-7233</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 11:02:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bripblap.com/2008/and-lo-at-the-outback-they-rejoiced/#comment-7233</guid>
		<description>Since this parable comes from the New Testament, we surely must look at it from a religious point of view (whether we are religious or not).  So, from a Christian point of view, this parable is entirely defensible.  Of course we forgive the &quot;wanderer&quot; and welcome him/her back into the fold.  But having seen this dynamic played out in my local church, in families, and on the national scene, I can say that it bothers me to some extent that the prodigal gets to resume life just as if nothing has happened.  God may have the magnanimity to do this, but it&#039;s awfully hard to be the one plodding along, doing the work, going to the meetings, never taking a day off, and never to get some sort of acknowledgment.  Or, from a religious point of view, it&#039;s hard to be the one who never drank or gambled or took drugs or had multiple affairs, and be totally ignored and taken for granted or, even worse, be considered a boring person.  There&#039;s a big difference between what God can do and what works with people.  Most people need encouragement.  They need a reward, be it a bonus or a day off, or your name on a plaque.  The parable was meant to show that God will forgive, but was meant to be a lesson in family or business dynamics?  I&#039;m not so sure about that.  
     
And do I think the elder brother forgave his younger brother?  That all depends on the younger brother&#039;s attitude.  He might if the younger brother is willing to start over, really start over from the ground up.  If the younger brother expects to come back as an equal, then no, there&#039;s going to be resentment.  Again, there&#039;s a big difference between the theological interpretation and the real-world interpretation.  Theologically, sure, if they both died the next day, they would both go to heaven, i.e. get the same reward, but on earth, I think the elder brother would rightfully expect that the younger brother should start in the shipping department and work his way back up to a corner office!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Since this parable comes from the New Testament, we surely must look at it from a religious point of view (whether we are religious or not).  So, from a Christian point of view, this parable is entirely defensible.  Of course we forgive the &#8220;wanderer&#8221; and welcome him/her back into the fold.  But having seen this dynamic played out in my local church, in families, and on the national scene, I can say that it bothers me to some extent that the prodigal gets to resume life just as if nothing has happened.  God may have the magnanimity to do this, but it&#8217;s awfully hard to be the one plodding along, doing the work, going to the meetings, never taking a day off, and never to get some sort of acknowledgment.  Or, from a religious point of view, it&#8217;s hard to be the one who never drank or gambled or took drugs or had multiple affairs, and be totally ignored and taken for granted or, even worse, be considered a boring person.  There&#8217;s a big difference between what God can do and what works with people.  Most people need encouragement.  They need a reward, be it a bonus or a day off, or your name on a plaque.  The parable was meant to show that God will forgive, but was meant to be a lesson in family or business dynamics?  I&#8217;m not so sure about that.  </p>
<p>And do I think the elder brother forgave his younger brother?  That all depends on the younger brother&#8217;s attitude.  He might if the younger brother is willing to start over, really start over from the ground up.  If the younger brother expects to come back as an equal, then no, there&#8217;s going to be resentment.  Again, there&#8217;s a big difference between the theological interpretation and the real-world interpretation.  Theologically, sure, if they both died the next day, they would both go to heaven, i.e. get the same reward, but on earth, I think the elder brother would rightfully expect that the younger brother should start in the shipping department and work his way back up to a corner office!</p>
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